e2 v mono

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kerry,
if i switched to e2 instead of mono[im currently on 10g per day]
what difference would i feel or see in my physique?
i did take kre/alkaline caps which gave me strength. i am now on mono[this seems to have added weight] i want to try e2 next and i am curious as to what to expect,also can i take this up to a contest,
thanks

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kk - Ethyl Esters of amino acids absorb more easily and more efficiently than free form amino acids (there are numerous studies to show this) therefore an ethyl ester of creatine will absorb better than the monhydrate form, most literature points out that ethyl ester amino acids absorb 2-3 times more efficiently than free form amino acids.

Yes, John Hodgson (who is known for his condition) has used ethyl ester right to the day of the show.

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Sorry Kerry, but I feel I should mention the fact that regardless of the type of creatine ingested, it is the same compound which reaches the cell wall. Absorption at the gut wall is not a limiting factor.

I had a long discussion not so long ago with Paul Greenhaff on the same subject, he's very clear on this.
Stow

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kk - Im well aware of Paul Greenhaff and his work (you're in a privileged position talking with him), there is a lot of anecdotal evidence (I know that is not scientific) that when athletes take creatine e2 (ethyl ester) rather than monohydrate, they get a much less puffy look (holding less water) so the anecdotal evidence is that the creatine is absorbed better.

As I said on an earlier post, John Hodgson for his last couple of shows used Creatine Ethyl Ester right up to the day of the show but would never use monohydrate (we have tried it and it gave bodybuilders a film of water). After John's experiment, we have used it on a few bodybuilders.

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Scientifically it doesn't add-up, but real-world examples are both interesting and shouldn't be discounted.
I took a lot of mono over the years, then E2 for a while. At the mo I use mono again.
Both work in my opinion, but I didn't see a noticeable difference.
Steve

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Sorry to jump in the thread, but I have tried every form of creatine available and have never understood why people rate it so highly.

I was under the impression that a good workout, rest and diet were the key to muscle growth. At 6 foot and 212 lbs, I never got anywhere with creatine. Infact, I see it as the biggest waste of money in bodybuilding. But maybe it's not meant to be for some people?

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agreed with danny, i tried most types mainly mono but still awaiting E2. Its dissapointing when people say its brilliant then i feel no diff, maybe it is some people?

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creatine is a good product-but its not gear.
as a natty-the best to expect is 1-3 rep increase on your max set.
to me that is great-to others no big deal.

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I agree that creatine is a good product and it is the most researched of all the supplements on the market.

It has been around for some time now and most athletes take. It has stood the test of time, so it must do somthing.

However a lot of people expect to much from it and a lot of supplement companys hype it up. It will help you increase strength as long as your diet, training and rest is optimal, don't expect miracles it's just a supplement that will aid you.

John.

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i noticed about a 7 pound increase in weight when taking mono[water]
i look fuller/muscles look rounder/increase in energy and strentgh.
like john says.training/diet and rest must be key.

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It's done wonders for you then mate. I didn't gain anything from it

Ah well, it's cheaper for me to stick to the protein for supplements...

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how would u guys recommend taking mono, when in the day and how much and mixed with just water?

I heard somewhere that its good mixed with normal orange squash

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i put 5grams of mono in my gf before training[i know gf has 2.5g already]
and for pwo i add another 5grams into my pro recover.
maybe this is too much-but seems to be working.
i know some people who swear by putting it in their coffee pre workout.

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unfortunately some people are just non-responders to creatine - and you may be one of them. As for myself I get some results mainly an increase in strength but nothing great. Also the cost is prohibitive for me (wife and 2 kids to support so can just about afford protein powders) so when i have the cash i take it for about 2 months then stop. And i have heard that cycling supplements, including different proteins, gives better results

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following on from Iron head case above I have read that creatine is rendered neutral by caffeine in some studies and in other cases that both enhace performance.

What's the deal - is it a good idea to take creatine and caffeine or should the combination be avoided?

Also i have heard that the original british studies for the olympic team examined creatine in conjunction with caffeine which lead to its adoption by the olympic squad - any truth in that?

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kk - Creatine is probably the most researched product (supplement) and has been written about more than any other product and everyone has got an opinion, scientific and anecdotal. You should always rely on science but you will get confused. The reason people say don't use creatine with caffeine is they are opposite, one of the benefits of creatine -its a cell volumiser, it draws water into the muscle cells and the theory is hydrated muscle cell is stronger, caffeine is a diuretic and depending on your fluid levels could make your body short in water yet creatine needs water. Now living in the real world, how much water would the creatine need and how much water would be lost from caffeine, I dont think anyone can work this balance out.